Table of Contents for this issue:
re: Classic II vs PPC Mac
SE on the net
formatting a 400k disc
MacTCP on 68000 Macs
Re: Pseud040
Re: Color Classic
Re: Netscape on a 68000 Mac
Re: Pseud040
Carrying Case for Compact Macs
Rather fiddly Mac Plus hardware question
32 Bit Addressing
Mac II & Radius FPD
Re: Radius Pivot II video card
Help with HP printer!
Re: PB100 memory
Re: Sad SE
Re: 400K floppies
Classic Plus 1mb blinking ? on startup
netscape offline
AEHD+ Drive
128K System Software
Using a Quadralink Serial Board?
Digest Glitches

As the owner of both a 10 year old Mac II (Still in daily use) and a 6
month old PPC (Performa 6400/200) I feel like putting my 2 cents in about
Goos comments on Classics vs PPC:

1) I agree that classic Macintoshes are still very usable machines. The
response time doing ordinary tasks on my 16MHz Mac II are comparable to the
66MHz 486 PC I have to use at work. However, the 200MHz 603e Performa
blows both away even running emulated 68040 instead of native PPC code. I
don't know of any instance where the Mac II is faster.

2) Used classic Macs are a bargain these days. However, my Performa 6400
with 32MB RAM, 2.5GB hard drive, CD ROM, modem, and 15 inch monitor all
together cost roughly what I paid for just the internal 40MB hard drive 10
years ago for the Mac II ($1600 vs $1500). There is a lot of bang for the
buck (I hope this continues with the demise of the PPC clones).

3) Apple has definitely messed up the way it installs and configures
software on the Performa series. I didn't get a real system 7.5.3 CD-ROM.
The system CD supplied with the Performa only reinstalls the system and all
promotional demo software as the computer shipped, writing over anything
you may have on your hard drive. It has every extension in the world
active and takes umpteen megabytes of RAM just for the system. Pretty
crash-prone as configured by Apple. It took a few days to figure out what
extensions I didn't need and now the system (7.5.5) uses just under 8MB
RAM. (My Mac II uses just under 2MB of RAM for the same system 7.5.5.)
Downloading new versions of Open Transport and a few other updates and the
PPC almost never crashes. I never felt the need to upgrade to 7.6 for
"stability". I will try system 8.0 when I am convinced Apple has fixed the
bug that wipes out the hard drive on some 6400's and other models. Overall
I don't think my PPC is any more or less stable than the Mac II with the
configurations and software I am running. Both are more stable than the PC
clone running windoze at work.

4) Are you missing out on something by not having a PPC? Depends on what
you want to do. If you are doing number crunching or high end graphics
work, the speed improvement with PPC native software is awesome. E-Mail,
normal word processing, FTP file downloads, etc. there isn't a bit of
difference between PPC and older Mac's because you are limited by external
factors such as modem speed and how fast you can type.

Power PC's aren't perfect, but I am very happy overall with mine. We
bought the PPC only because the kids were always on the Mac II, now they
are on both. If you do buy one, there is no reason to get rid of your
Classic Mac.

Thanks
Dan Kelly

my step-daughter got an old Mac SE (i'm a PC dweeb), this has a small 20
meg HDD, 1 meg of RAM, and the 800k FDD. i bought her a USR 33.6 sportster
voice.

so, she wants to get on the `net. where's a source for browsers, TCP
software, and un-archivers (to unarchive all the software) that'll run on
this thing?

thanks
gordon

Hello All

For those of you who want to get on the web with a browser on a Plus, SE
or SE/30, Portable or other 68000 series Mac, here's the URL for the
MacWeb browser and all the extensions and control panels you'll need:

Http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/macweb.hqx

It will work with Macs with 2 megs minimum.

Here's the URL for an instruction manual on how to do it:
(Mentioned in the July MacUser magazine).

Http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/CompactMac2.sit.hqx

For TONS of shareware for older Macs, go to:

http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/classic.html

and for my shareware page, go to:

http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/Shareware.html

Enjoy!

JAG

A weird little oasis on the web. Download my Subgenius music, Mac
shareware, other assorted waste of bandwidth.
Http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/jagshouseone.html

I bought a 128K for $6.98 (!), and then bought the mouse and keyboard for
another $25 or so. I'd like to try to get it up and running, but am
having trouble. I grabbed System 1.0 from some archive (I've lost the
bookmark, dammit!), but then faced the problem of putting it on a 400K
disk the 128K would understand.

Just format an 800k disc as a 'one sided' disc and it'll be 400k. you can
buy these 800k's just about anywhere computer stuff is sold. I get mine at
WalMart.

JAG

A weird little oasis on the web. Download my Subgenius music, Mac
shareware, other assorted waste of bandwidth.
Http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/jagshouseone.html

mac tcp- has trouble working on plus and SE due to being 68000 macs...

however use Z-term.....and eudora 3.1 works fine on those macs using
system 6. the micromac upgrades are well WORTH the long green...I use
a micromac 50 mhz upgrade in my souped up SE/30 (32mb ram 400 hd @50
mhz-68030)

Nick

I use MACTCP and have configured several friends and client's 68000 Macs
with it for web use with zero problems over the past year and a half. Hmmm.

See my web site for tons of stuff relating to old Macs on the web.

JAG

A weird little oasis on the web. Download my Subgenius music, Mac
shareware, other assorted waste of bandwidth.
Http://www.eden.com/~arena/jagshouse/jagshouseone.html

yeah, I'M Interested in obtaining the shareware that allows older
macs to run like a 040..sounds like my cup of tea..

I'm currently running a SE/30 and a PB 160..

Nick

On 9/29/97 9:19 PM, Lorenzo141 wrote:

To: Classic Posts
From: Lorenzo141
Date: 28 Sep 97 14:52:44 -0500
Subject: Color Classic

This list is the greatest!

Anyway, I'm writing about the Color Classic. I am thinking of purchasing one
for my friend, but I am scared that I won't be able to run programs that
require a 640 x 480 resolution. Does anyone have any of the following
programs and run them successfully?

1. After Dark
2. AOL 3.0 for 68k Macintosh
3. Microsoft Word 6.0.1

Also, I have found a website that explains how to change the resolution by
altering the hardware inside the Color Classic. If anyone knows any
authorized service place that will attempt this, please tell me. Thanks!

Lorenzo141

Word and AD should run OK... AOL 3.0 will be missing some buttons (off
the screen.)

I've changed my monitor myself (see archives for details, plus's and minus's)

-NO AUTHORIZED SERVICE PLACE WILL ATTEMPT THIS... it is a hack, and is
NOT sanctioned by Apple. If a service place does this, they will no
longer be Apple Authorized if Apple finds out. Best bet is to get
somebody who knows what they're doing with CRTs who isn't authorized to
do it for you... it isn't that hard; you just have to be *really* careful.

'till next time,

Andrew Ludgate.
http://www.geocities.com/collegepark/3817

Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 00:11:43 +0100
To: Classic Posts
From: Donna Hood Pointer
Subject: Netscape on an SE

Miracle! I just installed Netscape 1.1N successfully on my SE. It has the
Applied Engineering accelerator with 16mb of ram. I set the Warp030
software to NOT answer 68000. When I had it set to 68000 it would not let
me install. I'm not set up with ConfigPPP etc so I haven't tried running it.

dpointer

For the one-thousandth time... (or at least it seems that way). NO version
of Netscape (even the 00 betas will work WITHOUT Color QuickDraw (CQD) in
the mother board ROMs. NO 6800 or accelerator for a 6800 has CQD in ROMs,
so Netscape will NOT run. PERIOD!! Nada, No, UhUh....

http://www.igha.org/pmu_link.html

As a shameless plug, I am now adding the finishing touches to my
new shareware offering, "Pseud040." This control panel allows '020 and
'030 Macs to emulate an '040 processor, much in the manner of SoftwareFPU
and the FPU. I am interested to see if this allows people to run OS8 on a
non-040. Currently, I have acheived such successes as running Dark Forces,
Infini-D and Warcraft II on a Mac II. This is sort of interesting. Email
me if you're interested - it'll be distributed in about a week.

Michael, thanks for taking over the list...!!

As much as I would like to give you good news, the Sys 8 install looks at
the MB ROMS, so even if you have a real `40 on the board as an add-on, it
will not install.

System 7.6.1 is the last version that will install on a `30 or `20 Mac.
System 8.1 will also support `40 Macs, but YellowBox will not.

http://www.igha.org/news.html

There sure are a lot of Compact Mac users out there...

I bought a great item from Sun Remarketing a few days ago. It's a
carrying case for Compact Macs (I'm not sure if a Color Classic will fit).
It appears to be very high-quality, well padded, and NOT used. The brand
is "Targus." It has:

zippered top
detachable shoulder strap
small pouch (perfect for my small modem)
extra piece of 1-foot square padding
long pocket on outside for normal size keyboard
other pockets on inside and outside
a bunch of velcro
handles to allow carrying upright for sideways.

It even came with a separate case for an extended keyboard.

Price was $19.00 + $7.00 for UPS Ground shipping. I found it while
browsing Sun's website. They had two different Compact Mac carrying
cases, but the item # for the one I bought is 711-120.

Now I can carry my Mac SE/30 onto an airplane - the case will definitely
fit overhead and maybe even under the seat.

Sun Remarketing's contact info is:

(800) 821-3221
http://www.sunrem.com

I hope someone finds this information useful.

- Ken Watanabe

I've been thinking a bit more about my Plus, and the way that it makes
nasty arcing noises when you turn it off (at the mains or using the switch
on the back of the Plus). (It works fine otherwise (if you ignore the
off-centre screen picture) - it's been on for many hours at a time and the
only time it's behaved badly was when the dodgy mains lead it came with was
making an intermittent connection with the corroded mains input pins of the
Plus. Five minutes cleaning the mains input pins and replacing the mains
lead solved *that* one.)

This arcing noise is obviously a Bad Thing. I've fitted a snubber and a
pair of surge-supressing varistors inside the Plus which has reduced the
arcing sound, but I'm sure it shouldn't be happening in the first place.

So what I was thinking was this:

1) The power supply circuit design shouldn't be allowing this to happen.

2) Therefore something isn't right

3) It's probably a dead capacitor or something like that

So I thought, given that the PSU's full of old electrolytics and the like,
why not just replace them? All well and good, but... I'm not sure of the
spec of all of the capacitors (some of them are marked very cryptically),
and it's a bit of a crude way of going about things.

I was wondering this: does anyone have any experience of fixing a similar
fault? Or (unreasonable hope) does anyone have such a thing as a circuit
diagram of the PSU of a Mac Plus?

Thanks in advance (again),
Rowland.

Thanks to all of those who sent me emails about the crash and burning of
Claris 2.0 and Works 2.0E. I sent that particular post to Classic Macs
ages ago. Not long afterward, I found out that my son had turned 32 bit
addressing and installed 12 megs of virtual memory. Easy to correct. He
has his own 460 Classic Performa and is at college now. A big thanks....

Dale Hill |
http://www.tanet.net/~dhill
http://www.tanet.net/~sunlib

Hello.

I have a Mac II (8 megs RAM, 60 meg HD, System 6.0.8, stock video) which
I would like to use with a grey-scale Radius Full Page Display. However when I connect the
Radius monitor to the Mac II, all I get is a dark screen. The Mac II works just fine with my other montiors and the Radius FPD works with my other macs.

Any ideas would be appreciated.

Robert Carr

[MODERATOR]

I think the problem is the stock video you mentioned. The NuBus
video card Apple gave the Mac II is most likely not able to support the
Radius display because it is not a 13" monitor. On such video cards,
multiscan monitors or monitors with a single resolution greater than
640 by 480 don't work.

[END MODERATOR]

Does anyone know where I can find a Pivot video card, or know of any other
way to hook up an old Pivot(Model 0276) to a Mac IIvx? Also looking for
info on hooking up a Radius TPD/19 to a IIvx. I'm about to go out and grab
a sync adaptor, but if there is a circuit I can build myself or a cheap
adaptor out there somewhere...

See http://www.radius.com/Support/www/mono_pivots.html
for info on the Radius 0276 monochrome Pivot monitor.

and the Dynamic Desktop 3.3 control panel." These are all available at
ftp://ftp.radius.com

Here is info on the cable you will need:
http://www.radius.com/Support/TechWeb/Cables/0029.html

Here is info for the TPD/19:
http://www.radius.com/Support/www/TPD_OLD.html

Richard

I need some help with some truly classic Macs. In my classroom I have
rebuilt some computers for my students to use. They include a Mac Plus,
and Mac SE. I have set up my own Appletalk network and the children love
being able to output their creations using the HP printer that I won with
a grant. However I have a problem. The latest and even earlier HP drivers
won't run on my classic Macs. In fact any driver that tries to use the
color capabilities will not work on my machines. I don't need color. I
just want the older machines to be able to print to the HP over
Appletalk. So if anyone has a printer driver for any Deskwriter that will
work over Appletalk with the Plus or SE, could you please contact me. My
students and I would greatly appreciate it!

Thanks,
Nicholas Kelly

someone wrote:

the maxium amount of ram for the PB 100, is sadly, only 8mb. 2mb was
the standard along with a 20/40 HD..so to UPGRADE one must find 2 or
more ram cards for the 100 series.

Hold it! PB100s will only take one expansion card in addition to the 2Mb on
the main board. Those cards were available in 2,4 & 6 Mb sizes, giving
total capacities of 4,6 & 8Mb respectively. You can't AFAIK ever have more
than one RAM expansion card. See the PB100 FAQ page for more info - URL in sig.

someone else wrote:

You can max a PB 100 out at 8mb. All you do is install (or have
someone install) one 6mb simm in the expansion slot. If you already
have a simm in their, take it out and replace it with the bigger one.
You can get simms anyplace. Just get the one that goes in the pb100.
the max configuration is the single 2mb that is soldered in plus the
6mb expansion slot chip.

Just to clarify; these are plug-in boards, NOT standard SIMMS! OK?

Stuart Bell
Acorn user? Visit http://www.poppyfields.net/sasaug/

To: Classic Posts
From: meberly
Date: 28 Sep 97 14:55:54 -0500
Subject: Sad SE

I just brought this SE home and not two days later, I get
the Sad Mac Icon.

It was working just fine for two days and I was attempting
to network it with an SE/30 when, after running for about 10
mins, the screen gets lines all across it. I restart ed and
I get the Sad Mac Icon with the numbers 00000004 and
00000040 below. I understand these codes give some clue as
to what it going wrong, but I don't have a decoder.

According to Apple:

$0004 The RAM test failed while testing bank A. The Z field indicates
which bits failed as in code $0002.

If I were you, I'd assume that it had something to do with the RAM SIMMs
working loose or something - I'd take each SIMM out, clean up the contacts
(SIMM and socket - you'll need some switch cleaner for this), and put them
back in.

This is a non-trivial job - if you're not happy with the idea of taking
your compact Mac apart, avoiding the dangerous high voltage video circuitry
(which can still be at high voltages even when the Mac's unplugged), and
avoiding frying the static-sensitive RAM SIMMs, do get someone to do it for
you if possible.

It that's not the problem, you might have had a SIMM fail on you. The
solution if to identify and replace the faulty SIMM.

[snip]

Rowland.

To: Classic Posts
From: tom
Date: 28 Sep 97 14:59:00 -0500
Subject: 400K floppies

I bought a 128K for $6.98 (!), and then bought the mouse and keyboard for
another $25 or so. I'd like to try to get it up and running, but am
having trouble. I grabbed System 1.0 from some archive (I've lost the
bookmark, dammit!), but then faced the problem of putting it on a 400K
disk the 128K would understand.

I tried reformatting a HD (1.4MB) disk on a Power Mac using an old, old
reformatting program called Fast Formatter (available at

http://www6.zdnet.com/cgi-bin/texis/swlib/mac/infomac.html?fcode=MC11682).

But the 128K didn't recognize it: Either there's a problem with trying to
create a 400K disk using the Power Mac's SuperDrive or the 128K's drive
is simply busted.

Any thoughts? Or even any ideas on where I could get working 400K disks
without too much trouble?

First thing: you need to get proper 800K (720K DOS) discs. They need to be
formatted as 400K discs - that is, single sided. These discs don't have a
square hole across from the write-protect hole like 1.4MB discs do.

My Performa 475 can't format a disc as single-sided - I expect that your
PowerMac can't either.

If I put an 800K disc into my System 6.0.8 Mac Plus that's been formatted
in my System B1-7.6.1 Performa 475, the Plus says that it needs minor
repairs and asks permission to perform them - if you say `yes', you get an
okay disc.

The System 6.0.8 Mac Plus *can* format a disc as a single-sided 400K disc.
I assume that it's happy creating early OS boot discs, although I've not
tried - I do have a 512Ke, but I can't be bothered to do any tests at the
moment. (If someone has some more information and/or would like to know,
I'll happily do some more tests - it's just a bit slow, you know, and I've
got some shopping to do).

My Performa 475 can't create a disc the 512Ke can boot off; it can't create
a disc the Plus can boot off using the System 6.0.8 installer; although I
recall that the System 6.0.8 Installer disc *did* allow the Plus to boot
after some minor repairs.

Anyway, I'm posting this to the mailing list in the hope that someone else
has some more information about creating boot discs for old Macs - does
anyone know exactly what's going on here? Does anyone know anything more
than I do?

Rowland.

I just got a Mac Plus 1mb, no hd donated to me. It didnt come with any
floppies and when i turn it on all i get is a floppy disk icon with a
blinking question mark(?) on it. I take it that it is looking for a system
folder somewhere and not finding it. i took a Macintosh Disk Tools disk
made from my PowerPC 7600 and it just spit it out (both disks). There is an
external floppy disk drive (im not sure if its a superdrive, it looks
generic and has model #AS1-4KR). so maybe i need 800k disks? or what? where
can i get them ? is there a place to just download the
software? thanks.

-sean

sean keane |www.sfk.home.ml.org

[MODERATOR]

No problem. The Plus (and probably its external drive) takes 800k
floppies. That's why it spits out your Disk Tools disk (not that it
would have enough memory to boot anyway.) You can get disk images
for old system software (aim for 6.0.8) at <ftp.apple.com. You can
put these images on 800K disks using the PowerMac, I suppose.

In the absence of real 800K disks, cover the left hole of a high-density
disk with Scotch tape.

[END MODERATOR]

Subject: Netscape on an SE
Miracle! I just installed Netscape 1.1N successfully on my SE. It has the
Applied Engineering accelerator with 16mb of ram. I set the Warp030
software to NOT answer 68000. When I had it set to 68000 it would not let
me install. I'm not set up with ConfigPPP etc so I haven't tried running it.

You can start-up netscape without going online, by dropping an html or
text file that is on your hard drive, onto the netscape icon. Once its
open and running, go to the Options dialogue and paste the URL from the
location window in the start-up page field.

It'll say something like "file:///YourHardDrive/FolderName/filename".(3
backslashes indicate a local file.)

Set that as your start-up page and then when you open netscape, it won't
try to dial-up.

You can use netscape to browse your hard drive and open any text, html,
gif, or jpeg files.

Really anything that you have netscape configured to view either
natively or through plug-ins.

I like to point it at mail folders and open them up. The folder opens as
one long text file that can be printed for archives,with all headers,
(dates/times) intact.

Eric Lyons
http://www.web-brothers.com/gallery.html is served by a IIsi....

To: Classic Posts
From: dpointer
Date: 25 Sep 97 18:20:48 -0500
Subject: re: MacPlus and HDFD query Brian Robson

AE made three external floppy disk drives for Macintosh
and Apple II computers.
...1. AEHD PlusDrive--SuperDrive Compatibility for the Mac
Plus, SE and II.(AE PlusDrive...)

Thank-you for the info. The FDHD drive is working with my Plus, but it can
only read 800K disks.

The AEHD+ needs an Extension (old method, less reliable) or a control panel
(latest, most reliable) to read 1.44M disks.

Bob Poland

Brian: If you don't have the diskette and you DO have the AEHD+ (not one of
the others), I can email it to you if you need it. It should have come with
the drive. Send me your email address. Donna Pointer

I am almost ready to fulfill one of my life's dreams.

I have finally got an original 128K Mac in mint condition.
(As soon as the logic board is sent to me by Sun Remarketing)

All I need is a very early (if not the first) version of the Mac OS on
a 400K disk.

I think it is version 0.5.

I was sent version 0.5 by someone from this list and I thank you.

But, I cannot transfer it from my newer / modern Mac to a 400K disk.

Could someone send me a disk in the mail?

I'd be most thankful.

There's no telling what I might do for your gracious act (beyond paying
for postage).

:)

-- daniel ray norris
norris.net

Is anyone out there using a Quadralink serial port board by Applied
Engineering? I just bought one of these used and expected a disk with a
driver or extension on it, but it didn't come with that. I'm just
wondering, if anyone is using the board, does it require and extension
or anything? If so, where can I obtain such a thing?

Thank you

-Jason Rothwell

Well, sorry about the delayed Digest. It's here now, anyway.

I have solved the problem of the strange characters working
their way into message headers. It should no longer plague us.

Michael Connolly